We get a rare drop, where circumstances suddenly allow a leftist position to become the mainstream position. Then inevitably, someone posts “America only cares about <leftist position> because it started impacting normies”.
And somehow the reaction is not “Hell yeah it did, brother, now is our time, let’s rolllllll!” but instead passing that tweet around while going “tsk-tsk”.
What the actual fuck are we doing? If we got a gift horse, we’d probably say “Hold up lemme enroll in equine dentistry school for next semester”. Like goddamn.
To get them to care of the war at all, especially the MAGAts, is a goddamn miracle really. We should be pushing them to want to end it and exposing them to leftist, not neo-liberal, actual leftist thinking.
an op to convince people that both parties are the same, so it doesn’t matter if you vote. The bad faith argument that voting for harm reduction is the same as voting for harm. It’s disingenuous and only serves to break leftist coalition and cause infighting, which only really benefits one side… the right, and it’s a textbook tactic of right-wing bullshit.
So yes, a psyop, or duped by a psyop. Eitherway, a dipshit.
To claim Joe Biden was a “harm reduction” candidate, you need to ignore how he extended much of Trump’s Term 1 policies and - by refusing to prosecute and imprison any of his first term cabinet - paved the way for even more egregious abuses in his second term.
The Biden Administration did nothing to curb the abuses of the Republican Party. And, in many cases, normalized and entrenched the fascist policies and powers accrued to the executive branch under prior terms of office. When the ink is dry on the history books, he will be remembered as an enabler of Trump’s fascist regime in much the same way he was an enabler of the Bush fascist regime from 2001 to 2009.
This is an anarchist community, so here’s an anarchist perspective. Voting is not and cannot be harm reduction.
The idea of a ballot being capable of reducing the harm in a system rooted in colonial domination and exploitation, white supremacy, hetero-patriarchy, and capitalism is an extraordinary exaggeration. There is no person whose lives aren’t impacted everyday by these systems of oppression, but instead of coded reformism and coercive “get out the vote” campaigns towards a “safer” form of settler colonialism, we’re asking “what is the real and tragic harm and danger associated with perpetuating colonial power and what can be done to end it?”
Voting as harm reduction does more harm than good. Accepting reforms through voting makes people settle for a partial goal; it is a concession. From this position of compromise, the state entrenches its position, and it becomes more difficult to push further, for voters fear losing their partial gains. Accepting harm reduction also divides the movement, because some will be satisfied with the crumbs, while others want it all (see the split at the ZAD). Harm reduction also assumes that the harm (the government) cannot be removed entirely, which is an argument that there can be no anarchy.
Voting is not harm reduction
For the vast majority of issues, there’s no difference between the political parties. They are all the parties of business, climate destruction, deportation, incarceration, police, surveillance, drone strikes, sacred site desecration, et cetera. By getting you to believe that there is a lesser of two evils, the state dampens your desire for abolishing it, because you are meant to believe that things will be worse if you don’t vote and support a political party. Look at the fact that the George Floyd Rebellion occurred under Trump, where liberals, and progressives, and leftists didn’t get what they want, where the harm was supposedly greater, than under Biden, where those same people lie dormant, accepting the lesser evil world as a blessed reprieve.
A lot of internet anarchists are like any other internet leftist: their main “actions” are gatekeeping, purity tests, and virtue signaling that they’re real [whatever flavor of the left they claim]. They have zero pragmatism and no actionable plans – but they get pissed if anyone suggests something that doesn’t perfectly align with their professed ideals.
They don’t actually do anything for their cause in the real world: all they do is bitch on the internet and to their close circle of interchangeable friends. They’re the dead wood of progressiveness.
Which to be fair, is kind of the case for a majority of the population
It’s clearly not. I don’t sit in a box until election day. I’ve got a household to tend to, friends to support, family to care for, and an economy to participate in. All of these actions have political implications and consequences.
People need to recognize that caring for an ailing parent, holding down a job at a convenience store, opening up your house to a roommate (or renting that unit for a profit), driving a car versus riding a bike, calling the cops, littering - these all carry political weight. How you spend the majority of your waking hours is still a consequence of your ideology even in constrained circumstances.
I’m glad you don’t, what I mean is that for a lot of people, participating in a democracy rarely goes beyond voting every cycle, even if they do other actions that can be considered participation to democracy
Both-sidesism isn’t anarchism. It’s nihilism. It’s the “nothing matters, so there are no rules” surface level “anarchism” take. You can’t hide behind hedonistic nihilism by calling it “anarchism”. You might as well just come out as the edgelord you want to be and tip your fedora.
howabout this, rather than sit here and argue theory and bullshit… lets reframe what you’re doing here and see if that’s the person you idealize yourself to be.
You’re coming to the defense of a powertripping mod that abuses their position to push centrist bullshit and then bans anyone who disagrees with them.
Would you, as an anarchist, come to defend any other self-appointed hierarchical leader that pushes harmful misinformation and silences critics? Hmm? Is this your ideal anarchist community member?
I don’t think the mod is power tripping. They used the piefed default ban length (2100-2026=74), and the mod is allowed to moderate their community as they see fit. They don’t allow aggressive neoliberal talking points. That’s their choice.
I’m a fan of the community, so I’m familiar with the mod’s behavior. They aren’t centrist, they were criticizing the democratic party. I don’t necessarily agree with the post, but that doesn’t make it misinformation.
As a mod of a few communities myself, we’re custodians of a community, not “hierarchical leaders”.
The principle of free association means that I can freely interact with them as long as both parties see it as mutually beneficial. If I didn’t like the mod, what they post, or their community, then I block them. If they don’t like me, what I post, or my communities, then they block me.
voting for harm reduction is the same as voting for harm
psyop, or duped by a psyop. Eitherway, a dipshit.
You might as well just come out as the edgelord you want to be and tip your fedora.
you don’t read and huff your own farts.
howabout this, rather than sit here and argue theory and bullshit
Engage with what is being said instead of trying to appeal to some reddit-tier fallacy argument.
And lets see… a “leftist” in “leftist spaces” making plays from the “alt-right handbook”, misrepresenting them as “leftist” opinions to fracture coalition… what would you call a person like that?
Maybe if you write it bigger then you win. Actual child
I’m done playing debatelord with you reddit rejects.
What is with the large text? I think you make a great point about supposed leftist that are not leftist at all. We see a lot of that here on Lemmy. I think it may be a horseshoe thing or they are just lying to themselves.
I’m getting damn tired of this style of liberal comment in an anarchist community.
We get a rare drop, where circumstances suddenly allow a leftist position to become the mainstream position.
No you haven’t. You’ve got people who are upset their wallets are hit, that is not a leftist position in the mainstream. Two people can reach the same conclusion for wildly different reasons.
The left isn’t doomed thanks, we’re doing just fine.
Liberals and centrists are however doomed as people are moving to either extreme and abandoning a failed system that has only delivered abysmal results.
Go cry about purity tests some more, maybe that will convince a leftist to vote for murdering children if you do it a few more times.
We’ll talk about material conditions until we’re blue in the face, and then when material conditions change it becomes “well people are only receptive to this because it’s hitting their wallets!”
No shit! That’s the whole leftist argument! Material conditions drive politics more than ideology!
You keep doing whatever you’re doing (mostly nothing). But don’t expect the rest of the world to not point out your bullshit while your pedophile president is raping the world.
You are again acting selfish by portraying yourself as victims, while your government is ruining the world. You are NOT the victims, you are the PERPETRATORS.
Fucking jokers, fix your shithole country if you want the world to stop making fun of you. Because no one else can, the only thing we can do to vent our frustrations is to call out your bullshit.
I’m getting damn tired of this style of post.
We get a rare drop, where circumstances suddenly allow a leftist position to become the mainstream position. Then inevitably, someone posts “America only cares about <leftist position> because it started impacting normies”.
And somehow the reaction is not “Hell yeah it did, brother, now is our time, let’s rolllllll!” but instead passing that tweet around while going “tsk-tsk”.
What the actual fuck are we doing? If we got a gift horse, we’d probably say “Hold up lemme enroll in equine dentistry school for next semester”. Like goddamn.
To get them to care of the war at all, especially the MAGAts, is a goddamn miracle really. We should be pushing them to want to end it and exposing them to leftist, not neo-liberal, actual leftist thinking.
Removed by mod
A psyop to convince people not to vote for Kamala Harris in 2026?
The logic:
an op to convince people that both parties are the same, so it doesn’t matter if you vote. The bad faith argument that voting for harm reduction is the same as voting for harm. It’s disingenuous and only serves to break leftist coalition and cause infighting, which only really benefits one side… the right, and it’s a textbook tactic of right-wing bullshit.
So yes, a psyop, or duped by a psyop. Eitherway, a dipshit.
To claim Joe Biden was a “harm reduction” candidate, you need to ignore how he extended much of Trump’s Term 1 policies and - by refusing to prosecute and imprison any of his first term cabinet - paved the way for even more egregious abuses in his second term.
The Biden Administration did nothing to curb the abuses of the Republican Party. And, in many cases, normalized and entrenched the fascist policies and powers accrued to the executive branch under prior terms of office. When the ink is dry on the history books, he will be remembered as an enabler of Trump’s fascist regime in much the same way he was an enabler of the Bush fascist regime from 2001 to 2009.
Harris adviser says VP ran ‘flawless’ campaign
I have to wonder if you genuinely believe people who say this.
This is an anarchist community, so here’s an anarchist perspective. Voting is not and cannot be harm reduction.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/voting-is-not-harm-reduction
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/anonymous-why-you-shouldn-t-vote#toc1
This entire argument assumes no one does anything other than vote
A lot of internet anarchists are like any other internet leftist: their main “actions” are gatekeeping, purity tests, and virtue signaling that they’re real [whatever flavor of the left they claim]. They have zero pragmatism and no actionable plans – but they get pissed if anyone suggests something that doesn’t perfectly align with their professed ideals.
They don’t actually do anything for their cause in the real world: all they do is bitch on the internet and to their close circle of interchangeable friends. They’re the dead wood of progressiveness.
Which to be fair, is kind of the case for a majority of the population, which is perfectly fine for, and encouraged by, the people of power
It’s clearly not. I don’t sit in a box until election day. I’ve got a household to tend to, friends to support, family to care for, and an economy to participate in. All of these actions have political implications and consequences.
People need to recognize that caring for an ailing parent, holding down a job at a convenience store, opening up your house to a roommate (or renting that unit for a profit), driving a car versus riding a bike, calling the cops, littering - these all carry political weight. How you spend the majority of your waking hours is still a consequence of your ideology even in constrained circumstances.
I’m glad you don’t, what I mean is that for a lot of people, participating in a democracy rarely goes beyond voting every cycle, even if they do other actions that can be considered participation to democracy
Both-sidesism isn’t anarchism. It’s nihilism. It’s the “nothing matters, so there are no rules” surface level “anarchism” take. You can’t hide behind hedonistic nihilism by calling it “anarchism”. You might as well just come out as the edgelord you want to be and tip your fedora.
no one is saying “both sides”, as though there are only two. we’re talking about what harm reduction is, and whether voting qualifies. it does not.
Removed by mod
badjacketing isn’t allowed here.
When neither side is an anarchist position? It’s not two sides. It’s one side with two faces.
Wtf are you talking about?
howabout this, rather than sit here and argue theory and bullshit… lets reframe what you’re doing here and see if that’s the person you idealize yourself to be.
You’re coming to the defense of a powertripping mod that abuses their position to push centrist bullshit and then bans anyone who disagrees with them.
Would you, as an anarchist, come to defend any other self-appointed hierarchical leader that pushes harmful misinformation and silences critics? Hmm? Is this your ideal anarchist community member?
it doesn’t matter if you vote
voting for harm reduction is the same as voting for harm
psyop, or duped by a psyop. Eitherway, a dipshit.
You might as well just come out as the edgelord you want to be and tip your fedora.
you don’t read and huff your own farts.
howabout this, rather than sit here and argue theory and bullshit
Engage with what is being said instead of trying to appeal to some reddit-tier fallacy argument.
And lets see… a “leftist” in “leftist spaces” making plays from the “alt-right handbook”, misrepresenting them as “leftist” opinions to fracture coalition… what would you call a person like that?
Maybe if you write it bigger then you win. Actual child
I’m done playing debatelord with you reddit rejects.
What is with the large text? I think you make a great point about supposed leftist that are not leftist at all. We see a lot of that here on Lemmy. I think it may be a horseshoe thing or they are just lying to themselves.
they’re all quotes from the banned user
Oh okay, I get it now. Thanks.
lol. Maybe if you write it bigger then you win. Actual child. I’m done playing debatelord with you reddit rejects.
it’s not too late to delete your comments and leave.
If you can’t win by reason, go for volume.
lol
i’m not trying to win. i just wanted everyone to get a little amuse-bouche of the thread before they dive in.
They’re one of those 100 posts a day weirdos that seem hopped up on Adderall. Or they’re a bot.
Ai would like a word with you.
I’m getting damn tired of this style of liberal comment in an anarchist community.
No you haven’t. You’ve got people who are upset their wallets are hit, that is not a leftist position in the mainstream. Two people can reach the same conclusion for wildly different reasons.
This is why the left is doomed. You cant see the opportunity to bring more into the fold, you only see purity test fails and a chance ro grand stand
The left isn’t doomed thanks, we’re doing just fine.
Liberals and centrists are however doomed as people are moving to either extreme and abandoning a failed system that has only delivered abysmal results.
Go cry about purity tests some more, maybe that will convince a leftist to vote for murdering children if you do it a few more times.
Thanks for providing an example
When people’s wallets are hit it’s exactly the right time to convert people.
people’s wallets have been constantly hit for like 40+ fucking years now, this isn’t even remotely new.
We’ll talk about material conditions until we’re blue in the face, and then when material conditions change it becomes “well people are only receptive to this because it’s hitting their wallets!”
No shit! That’s the whole leftist argument! Material conditions drive politics more than ideology!
deleted by creator
You keep doing whatever you’re doing (mostly nothing). But don’t expect the rest of the world to not point out your bullshit while your pedophile president is raping the world.
You are again acting selfish by portraying yourself as victims, while your government is ruining the world. You are NOT the victims, you are the PERPETRATORS.
Fucking jokers, fix your shithole country if you want the world to stop making fun of you. Because no one else can, the only thing we can do to vent our frustrations is to call out your bullshit.
Oh just fix the country, why didn’t anyone tell us that sooner!
Oh, so you are expecting someone else to fix it for you, smh…
And in the meantime we should feel sorry for you, while you keep raping us. That sounds almost selfish…
You’re using this word very liberally.